Anthem SL - thin & bright (noise as well!)

[wilburys]

Hi everyone,

I am new to the forum but I am a regular over at AGF. I thought I would bring some of my concerns with the Anthem SL over here to the experts!

I had the Anthem SL installed in my Taylor 310 a few months ago and I have never really loved the plugged in tone. My guitar always sounds bright and thin with too much of the tru-mic in the signal. I have sat and played with the mic level control but I find I either get a tone that's too muddy or one that's too bright. I can't really find a middle ground. I had the lyric in my Taylor before the Anthem SL and honestly, I was expecting more bass with the Anthem. However, out front and in my monitors at gigs, my guitar sounds just like the lyric. I had a friend play my Taylor while I mixed out front with my iPad and I was shocked at how much it sounded like the lyric (thin, bright, hollow etc). Even my friend commented on the mid range and hollow tone. It seemed to be lacking bass as well. .

When I had the SL installed, I also had a bone saddle put in to replace my Tusq. I will admit that the bone saddle has made my guitar far too bright. The high end is dominating my unplugged tone and hiding the bass that I used to have. I know this is probably impacting the plugged in tone but I thought the Element UST would still be a little more noticeable, especially for the enhanced bass. I am wondering if maybe the bone saddle is not working well with the Element?

Also, I am noticing that when I turn up the volume on the Anthem, hiss starts to increase in my amp/pa. I had the exact same issue with the lyric when I had it installed. It's not noticeable at a show but when I am sitting beside my amp or speaker, I can clearly hear it. I brought this to the attention of the Baggs folks when I had the lyric and I was told that the hiss sounded normal. Just wondering if anyone else has experienced that?

Thanks!

[Caleb_Elling]

Hey wilburys,
Thanks for posting.

There is a possibility that the bone saddle is softening the pickups response a bit, but that could be that specific piece of bone or the bone's interaction to the guitar. If the bone saddle softened the low-end acoustically, then I would expect it to do the same (more or less) to the amplified tone.

Do you still have the original Tusq saddle? If you did, it would be an easy A/B. I personally prefer Tusq over bone in most guitars, but each guitar is different. I've also found Micarta to be very consistent in most guitars.

As far as the hiss, the Anthem should be pretty quiet overall. What do you typically run your guitar through? (amp, preamp, effects, PA, etc.) And how do you run your guitar's volume level vs. your other gear?

[Rodney_UK]

Hi Wilbury,

I love the sound of a bone saddle over anything else. Problem is it doesn't work well with under saddle pickups. I removed my synthetic saddle, removed the under saddle pickup and installed a Lyric and bone saddle.

This is not ideal, but I don't think any system is.

What is important, which some people may disagree with is EQ. With EQ it is possible to sculpt the sound anyway you please, but this can be very difficult with an acoustic instrument.

I found that a narrowish 10db+ cut at 800hz tends to thicken up an acoustic sound.

With the Lyric I tend to slightly boost 100hz, but cut as much as possible below this. It helps to get rid of rumble and keeps the bass punchy and well defined. I have found for me that 125hz tends to feedback. Difficult to get a balance here sometimes.

I also cut the low mids around 250-350hz area with a wider band. This helps to get rid of a boxy sounding guitar. Also helps by making space for vocals.

There are a few other areas in the spectrum to adjust as well, depending on what sound you are looking for.

Kind Regards

Rodney

[wilburys]

Hey wilburys,
Thanks for posting.

There is a possibility that the bone saddle is softening the pickups response a bit, but that could be that specific piece of bone or the bone's interaction to the guitar. If the bone saddle softened the low-end acoustically, then I would expect it to do the same (more or less) to the amplified tone.

Do you still have the original Tusq saddle? If you did, it would be an easy A/B. I personally prefer Tusq over bone in most guitars, but each guitar is different. I've also found Micarta to be very consistent in most guitars.

As far as the hiss, the Anthem should be pretty quiet overall. What do you typically run your guitar through? (amp, preamp, effects, PA, etc.) And how do you run your guitar's volume level vs. your other gear?

Thanks Caleb,

I do have the original Tusq saddle but unfortunately it's too low to try. I had another UST in my guitar before I switched to the Anthem and Bone so the old UST must have been a bit thicker than the Element. I did however order a Tusq saddle so I am hoping to do some tests with it once it arrives.

I am with you on preferring Tusq to bone. I know bone can sound great with some instruments but IME, it can sound terrible on certain guitars, especially Larrivee and Taylor.

Generally I run my guitar through the Grace Design Felix preamp and then into my mixer. However, when I was testing the hiss, I was running straight into one of my QSC K12 speakers. I had the volume on the K12 set to an acceptable level for playing in my basement, with the Anthem volume on full. I like to run the volume on the Anthem on full at all times and then adjust the levels accordingly on the preamp/mixer to suit the venue. I am going to do some more tests because I remember thinking that the Anthem was quiet compared to the lyric I had previously. I just noticed the noise the last time I sat down to adjust the mic level control.

[wilburys]

Hi Wilbury,

I love the sound of a bone saddle over anything else. Problem is it doesn't work well with under saddle pickups. I removed my synthetic saddle, removed the under saddle pickup and installed a Lyric and bone saddle.

This is not ideal, but I don't think any system is.

What is important, which some people may disagree with is EQ. With EQ it is possible to sculpt the sound anyway you please, but this can be very difficult with an acoustic instrument.

I found that a narrowish 10db+ cut at 800hz tends to thicken up an acoustic sound.

With the Lyric I tend to slightly boost 100hz, but cut as much as possible below this. It helps to get rid of rumble and keeps the bass punchy and well defined. I have found for me that 125hz tends to feedback. Difficult to get a balance here sometimes.

I also cut the low mids around 250-350hz area with a wider band. This helps to get rid of a boxy sounding guitar. Also helps by making space for vocals.

There are a few other areas in the spectrum to adjust as well, depending on what sound you are looking for.

Kind Regards

Rodney

I have heard from some people that bone isn't a great material for UST's, but there are also those who think it works fine. Luckily, I want to go back to Tusq anyway so I am hoping that it fixes the unplugged and plugged in tone.

I was reading an interesting article written by some boutique/high end guitar makers who commented on bone saddles. Most of them pointed out that guitarists always think that a harder material like bone will be an easy and instant upgrade to their guitar. However, this is not always the best move since some guitars just don't respond well to bone. I think there's a reason why companies like Taylor ship their guitars, even their high end guitars, with Tusq and Micarta saddles.

[Rodney_UK]

Hi Wilbury,

Yeah it is very subjective. Best to do it the hard way (which we all do) which is find out for ourselves. I suppose we all have a sound that we are looking for. A bit of trial and error is all part of it I guess.

However, it is all about having the experience!

Best of luck

Rodney