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  • New Lyric pickup

    Just installed the Lyric in my Doubleneck 6 and 12 string Carbon Fiber guitar and the results have been well beyond my expectations. The guitar has two bridges and no bridge plates. I found that the lyric allows instillation over a pretty wide area and still picks up both necks and all 18 strings perfectly in balance. That is amazing and so counter intuitive. The pressure zone characteristics do indeed hear the entire soundboard at once. Not sure you guys anticipated what this product does for this type of challenging applications. Beyond that it is the most " sounds like your guitar" pickup I have ever used. Simply amazing and a miracle for my application. Wow!! Steve
    Last edited by 45flint; 02-03-2013, 02:38 AM.

  • #2
    I listened again to the NAMM Utube of Lloyd Baggs explaining the Lyric. He says that it is a pressure zone microphone and it averages the sound coming off the top. Thus the balance of all 18 strings of the Doubleneck no matter where they are connected, It's as if he developed this for my application. No doubt my application proves that this is just not Baggs marketing spin. I am surprised that no one else had applied this principle to the guitar. I do wonder if my braceless, plateless, carbon guitar gives the perfect platform for this: the mic 3mm off a perfectly flat and unobstructed surface?
    Last edited by 45flint; 02-03-2013, 06:54 AM.

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    • #3
      Here is a couple pictures of my Doubleneck installed Lyric. With two saddles and no bridgeplate I put it between the bridges. Worked fine over a pretty wide range of placements. My final pacement was a little lower more behind the string ends, just about centered under the access panel. You can see the flat unobstructed surface the carbon soundboard gives this application. It absolutely solved this very difficult problem of balancing all 18 strings with a simple solution. Before I was taking each bridge out separately through a stereo endplug and mixing and balancing outside the guitar with a two channel preamp. Simply an amazingly effective simple solution.
      Attached Files

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      • #4
        Thanks for sharing!

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        • #5
          Can the Lyric be used with a sound hole cover or maybe a semi lute type cover?

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          • #6
            It can be used with a soundhole cover, but the Lyric doesn't hear much sound that comes through the soundhole anyways. So I don't think that it would be very effective. I've never been a fan of the acoustic dampening that soundhole covers cause either.

            A good notch filter is definitely the best way to deal with Lyric feedback without killing the natural tone of your amplified sound.

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            • #7
              I read in the review of Acoustic Guitar (online version) that "The preamp also offers soldering pads for connecting a second source (such as a pickup), the signal of which goes unbuffered to the ring-channel of the output jack." Does this mean that, if I'm adding a Lyric to a guitar with an existing Fishman piezo pickup, that I could use this "unbuffered" capability for this by just soldering in the existing pickup leads?

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              • #8
                The Lyric jack would need to replace in the existing one in the endblock. Then, if your Fishman under-saddle can be used passively, it can be utilized for stereo output on the jack.

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                • #9
                  Caleb, forgive my lack of technical knowledge, but if a passive pickup can be soldered in, will using a regular mono guitar cable only pass the lyric's audio or would it only pass the additional pickup, or maybe no sound at all?
                  I ask because I'm considering a sort of a/b system in order to choose an already existing fishman transducer if for some reason the environment I'm playing in causes too much feedback or there's just too much ambience. Guitarists like options!

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                  • #10
                    Just Got Mine!

                    I knew my Lyric was going to arrive UPS, so I prepped my guitar ahead of time. I removed the Fishman under saddle pickup system, cleaned up the inside wood (mostly water and paper towels), and waited. When it arrived, I did the install. I had never had to work through a guitar sound hole like that. It was a bit harder than I thought but I managed. The Lyric didn't come with any clips (I thought it might), but I was able to use what was left over from the Fishman install. The Lyric fit nicely under the bridge plate. I had to install, removed, install, remove a couple times. The adhesive worked and I didn't have to use the spare adhesive pads. The volume control element, on the other hand, fell off. So, I had to use the spare adhesive. I think this happened because the underside of the sound hole was natural wood (no coating). I'm guessing the water and paper towel didn't quite get the job done. If I were to do this again, I'd prep the guitar ahead of time and add a bit of polyurethane (or tung oil) to the underside to seal the wood. Perhaps the adhesive would stick better.

                    If the adhesive for the volume doesn't work out (like, if it falls off again), I may try Velcro (or some other such system). The good news is that the volume control has an edge bumper that sits against the sound hole edge. But, with a Velcro approach, I could actually mount it upside down, seating it further into the body of the guitar (where that edge bumper would not get in the way). That way, should I need a hole plug (for feedback) I'd have the flexibility to be able to do this easily.

                    I did a before and after test using a keyboard amp in my garage. Earlier, I had played the guitar with my Fishman pickup and left the amp controls where they were. When I installed the Lyric and went back, the signal out of the guitar was much lower. I had to bump the amps volume a lot to get a equivalent sound. (Probably some kind of impedance thing.) Later, I plugged into my acoustic amp. The guitar sounded nice there and that amp didn't need as much volume adjusting. So much for keyboard amps. Tonight, I'll test it against a PA system and an open mic I'll be attending.

                    FWIW - the reason I installed the Lyric in the first place is that my Fishman system didn't have a volume control. I had made something I could wear on my belt that worked, but that was clumsy. I could add a volume control to the guitar, but the Fishman volume add-on was expensive and would require drilling holes. Finally, the under saddle pickup had that quacky sound that I didn't like sometimes. So, the Lyric install seemed like a good idea. So far, it was well worth it.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by tedswan View Post
                      Caleb, forgive my lack of technical knowledge, but if a passive pickup can be soldered in, will using a regular mono guitar cable only pass the lyric's audio or would it only pass the additional pickup, or maybe no sound at all?
                      I ask because I'm considering a sort of a/b system in order to choose an already existing fishman transducer if for some reason the environment I'm playing in causes too much feedback or there's just too much ambience. Guitarists like options!
                      Using a mono cable will pass the Lyric signal only. Using a stereo Y cable would allow you to use either the Lyric channel or the Piezo channel with different channels or a stereo blending preamp.

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                      • #12
                        rcdanek,
                        The Lyric's output is a little lower than undersaddle pickups, in general. I'm glad to hear that you are liking the sound so far though. I'm interested to hear your thoughts on how it sounds through a full PA, which is really where the Lyric does it's best work.

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                        • #13
                          Hey Caleb

                          I've read your statement that the Lyric sounds best through a full PA. I'm interested in getting a Fishman SA220 for solo church gigs. I would be buying the Fishman without trying the Lyric through it. I have only played my newer Larrivee 00 through my home studiio type system and it sounds very good with a bit of EQ. When I play at service I usually play piano now since they have many rotating guitarists and only a couple of piano players. I do occasionally use my Anthem SL equipped Northwood and it sounds good with no preamp.

                          So, I guess the question is: how does the Lyric sound through the Fishman?

                          Thanks
                          Kevin

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                          • #14
                            Kevin,
                            I've only heard the SA220 once, so I can't say much from personal experience. The SA and other systems like the Bose towers do pretty well in most situations. However, they do not naturally have a very flat EQ, so setting up the system first is very important. You should be able to get a pretty good sound though.

                            I should say that I prefer the Bose L1, but I've had more experience with it compared to the SA.

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                            • #15
                              Thanks, Caleb.

                              Originally posted by Caleb_Elling View Post
                              Kevin,
                              I've only heard the SA220 once, so I can't say much from personal experience. The SA and other systems like the Bose towers do pretty well in most situations. However, they do not naturally have a very flat EQ, so setting up the system first is very important. You should be able to get a pretty good sound though.

                              I should say that I prefer the Bose L1, but I've had more experience with it compared to the SA.

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